How Islam Began, Fred Donner: UnCommon Core Lecture

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    In recent decades there has been much scholarly debate over Islam's origins. The traditional Muslim view has increasingly been found inadequate, but critical scholarship has not been able to reach a consensus on how Islam arose. The present talk surveys the issues at stake and a number of interpretations that have been recently proposed to understand just what happened at the origins of Islam 14 centuries ago.
    Presentation by Fred Donner.
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    Publisert 8 år siden


    1. Noah Kennedy

      Fred Donner and scholars like him are the real heroes of modern thinking about religion. Calm and thoughtful scholarship is what we need to listen to and learn from. The anger and intolerance in the comments here are tiresome to read and toxic: nothing is as bad and nothing is as good as what is claimed here.

      1. Setadrift onfishandchips

        @Two Natal Yods agreed. Well said.

      2. Roronoa Ahmed

        @Jim Humpert now your making another claim about how Indonesia was forcefully convert to islam without proof. Your mixing ur Christian religion with islam where u guys forcefully converted almost half the world by the sword and if u would like a proof I can easily provide you.

      3. Roronoa Ahmed

        @Jim Humpert you made a claim that the Quran teaches hate and doesn't allow others to practice their faith and u referenced middle east like it represents islam when it doesn't have the highest muslim population. I asked u where it says in the quran u can't allow others to practice their faith or u have to force them to convert.

      4. Jim Humpert

        well you dont know me , every one klnows indonesia is most islamic populated country, so whats your argument, indonesia was founded on budahism, than islam has toke over by force, not by love.

      5. Roronoa Ahmed

        @Jim Humpert and if u had a brain u would know middle east isn't the largest population of muslims, its Indonesia where theres alot of other religions that practice their faith openly.

    2. alpay demir

      13 minutes, boring

    3. Heripal Danindra

      I love Muhammad because I am Islamic, the facts of the hadith and the Koran many sources for research professors such as biology: the origin of man from the womb, and the creation of the earth, and the function of mountains, stars, you can see the power of God, Muhammad can revelation and provide information to his people from God. when the prophet muhammad did not have a professor who could see the creation of the earth, please look at the Koran, sorry everyone I gave info to you to think not easy to believe people intend to blame other religions, Islam based on the Koran does not force other religions into Islam. if you don't know the fact, explaining to that person is a lie

    4. Nasser N

      It began when God (Allah) gave a last chance to humanity to go back to what we should’ve stayed on (worshipping the only god who created us) by sending his prophet (Muhammad) with the last massage (Islam)

    5. ManiThor

      He is f"n wrong when he says "allah equals God". allah is a brand of God(!), and does NOT equal God. It's like, for example; Ford is NOT equal Automobile. It is an automobile BRAND. The Christans do NOT believe in allah, they believe in YHWE. Becacuse YHWE is a BRAND of God, just like allah in islam. Please people do NOT fall for this nonsense..... that the majority of Western people, just like the speaker here in this video are under the influence of islamic propaganda.

    6. nawaf al-harthy

      There's some huge wrong information i encourage anyone want Lorne about Islam to read Quran and make his judge because this is information lies

    7. Neeraj Prakash

      Islam is shit

    8. Hasen Judy

      His Arabic pronunciation is very good!



    10. abderahmane bencheikh

      Thank you

    11. inner Reality

      Please Subscribe my channel for islamic information and best islamic lectures in urdu and English

    12. Disguised genius

      Not clear or descriptive enough, and also some very essential issues are skipped.

    13. Tech World

      This lecture cleared the meaning of many Ahaadith and there are few things on which I disagree but over all an impressive research on Islam by a non muslim

    14. Ali Uyar

      It may have been a totally different social restructuring, later succumbed to the disguised evil aristocrats. He may have been a real hero for humanity revamped to an other role by his usurpers. If so, I would like to meet him very much.

    15. Johnny Kama

      But the sources he is using for this are over 200 hundred years old? Are they reliable?

    16. Daily Islamic Hub

      I’ve never seen anyone do it better.

    17. the king 305

      لا الا الله محمد رسول الله

    18. richard jardeleza

      Fred, I hope you can make some topic next time about how Christianity started

    19. richard jardeleza

      You right Fred, how there be a trinity when there is only One God

      1. P Harrison

        Because HE is 3 persons and He can’t lie and has shown Himself to mankind 3 men appeared to Abraham! All 3 are YHVH. So either believe God & Abraham Or call God a liar!

    20. sahabe story

    21. Charlie Escalante

      Learned a lot from watching this. It is truly amazing how little we know about the past. As a teacher, I try to emphasize the use of primary sources, yet we have so little of them for such big topics like origins of religion.

    22. Richard Thornhill

      Good analysis. Tom Holland and many other scholars arrived at the same conclusion. Where is any historical or archaeological evidence to support the legends of Islam? Why is the earliest known written biography written about 200 years after his death? It developed as an aggressive ideology of conquest and occupation.

    23. Toosiya Brandt

      HI You need to check the Vatican Vaults! And failing that read Chick Publications ' The Prophet' because they did! Shalom to us only in Christ Yeshua.


      That all assumes a late Quran (AD 690+) because war is explicitly declared on Christians and Jews in it. Surah 9

      1. Didivs Ivlianvs

        Save your lies for the ignorant. Nobody invaded Arabia. You guys invaded everybody. Quran 9:123. "O you who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who are close to you, and let them find harshness in you; and know that Allah is with those who have Taqwa." Tafsir Ibn Kathir on 9:123 "Allah commands the believers to fight the disbelievers, the closest in area to the Islamic state, then the farthest. This is why the Messenger of Allah started fighting the idolators in the Arabian Peninsula. When he finished with them and Allah gave him control over Makkah, Al-Madinah, At-Ta'if, Yemen, Yamamah, Hajr, Khaybar, Hadramawt and other Arab provinces, and the various Arab tribes entered Islam in large crowds, he then started fighting the People of the Scriptures. He began preparations to fight the Romans who were the closest in area to the Arabian Peninsula, and as such, had the most right to be called to Islam, especially since they were from the People of the Scriptures..." [9.29] Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection. [9.30] And the Jews say: Uzair is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away! It was all just an excuse for a band of robbers and nothing more. Muhammad didn't even come from Mecca. He came from Petra.

      2. الأشاعرة أهل السنة

        The war is not against specifically Jews or Christian The war against all invadors and the ones who break treaties

    25. bg81973

      "allah" has evolved to mean "God". but the name allah preceded muhammed by hundreds of years and was the proper name of a god until muhammed and his followers through common usage of the name as meaning simply "god", changed the word from a proper name to a title.

    26. Jesus God_Savior

      God and Allah is the same in meaning. But God of he Bible and Allah of Islam are soooo way much different. ✝💞JESUS bless you.✌🙏

      1. Endtime 2016

        @Jesus God_Savior Yes we need to pray for Muslims who earnestly search for the truht. Here is one of my fabourite vids debunking the fastest growing religion myth.

      2. Jesus God_Savior

        @Endtime 2016 Precisely, allah is the God of the Pagan, also during the time of mohamad, the pagans who turn around the kabaa and kissing the blackstone,🙏✝💞Jesus bless all Moslems.✌🙏😘

      3. Endtime 2016

        _God and Allah is the same in meaning_ That's what they want us believe. The arabic word for God is 'iilah إله and Allah was the name of a God that existed before Muhammad was even born.

    27. theflyingstonemason 68

      Very interesting lecture on the origins of Islam. Christianity started in a similar way, with visions of Jesus seen by Mary of Magdalene after his death, which is very common with grief. She then told the disciples about seeing him alive, unknowingly then starting the spread of the religion. let the shit storm begin. 😈

    28. the world all

      There is no compulsory in religion. Take your belief and I take mine. If you can tell them also what will make them belief archeological evidents were not invented . Why was it important for you to take all those time to find out about Muslim??? You seems to have little knowledge with regards to Islam. You thought you understand but to a lay man like me , after listening to your lecture , I also understand that there is a hatred in your narrow mind . You are trying to put down the ideology of Islam and promote yours. Your school of thought , how did it come about? Encyclopedia where did they got all the information ??? Archeology , who invented it ?? What are your evidents . These are all man made invention. What you teaching , where did you got the information , what materials can you used to support your case if they are not man made. If you want to find information , find it from the rightful sources , you said lot of things here which you yourself aren't sure of, then why misleading people. The system you working for has been invented and you still want people to belief you. Your system is a cursed to humanity in general , you separate us , kill us , in the Quran , it's mentioned there that , if you think the Quran is invented , then produce a similar one to it, it challenged you . You can't. Please focus on something that's concern you and leave people who belief in it to live there life. You are too small to challenge Quran . Quran does not speak to only believe but even you who thinks otherwise , produce a copy of it. Quran is send down to all mankind . There is no exceptions . The more you try to sale out bad image about Islam , the more conscious people embrace Islam. . You don't even understand Arabic , you think those words you speak will convinced people to think that you understand Arabic. Lakum dini Kum walliysdin

    29. G7Batten Batten

      "It happened" through conquest, war, killing, violence. We know exactly how it happened because how it happened is described in their own texts. This is an extremely polished description of Islamic conquest - jihad. So polished that it is really disinformation.

      1. G7Batten Batten

        @Frances P You are looking at this in the way the establishment want you to look at it: all religions are equally bad or good. If you want to avoid lying you should ask yourself what is it in these text that they teach? People can be bad and violent regardless of what religion that they confess to. Yes that is true. However to what extent does the text support their violence? To what extent does their behavior mirror the behaviour of their religious leader? If they are killing people, did Buddha also kill? Did Jesus also kill? Did Mohammed also kill? Only Mohammed killed. There you have the truth. But most does not want to see this.

      2. NICK

        @Frances P oh goodness where did you get the nerve to say who isn't "real" Christians? The religious view of people of different faith and secularism is bad enough. Even other members of your own club aren't good enough.

      3. Frances P

        @ NICK those folks weren’t true Christian, I say that because in any religion the ones in power are the ones reeking havok on regular folks. When u r driven by human emotion, you don’t have God within u to guide you. Even in the Muslim world today those things are happening, we are not against the pious Muslims, we are against the violence within it. And not all the Muslims do that just because not everyone can have that mMaliciousness you got some really great folks, but in all walks of life including all their history was fought for other reasons that had nothing to do with God but human thinking and emotionswhich everyone knows is flawed. We need to pray for one another and have God do what he knows best, because so far everything he said that will go in is going as he said. Never let someone else’s opposition get the best of you that’s why God created temperance and patience, he’ll take care of all. God bless everyone here

      4. NICK

        Christians burned, hanged, shot and stabbed thousands of non-christians, Protestants, Mormons and Catholics right here in USA in the 20th century over their magic zeal. That's just lynchings. Just since 1900. Not counting murdering blacks and natives. The crusades and witch trials killed millions. Anyway Islam is a regional evolution of Christianity.

    30. Rigs75

      Religion is the biggest hoax ever perpetrated on the human race

      1. NICK


    31. moodist 1er

      Abrahamic religions (and parts of Islam that think they're not abrahamic) are poorly plagiarized from a dozen older religions. All mainstream religions are fascist inventions for social and economic control over labor and resources. Elites live like kings because the people consent (mostly because the people are illiterate).

    32. john doe

      Fred, you're what people call a muslim apologist. Why dont you say the full facts?

    33. john doe

      How can you call yourself a scholar when you completely cut off all the negative aspects of islam, and make it seem like it's just another religion like christianity or buddhism. He was kicked out of mecca due to him insulting the people and their gods. Islam isnt an abrahamic religion, if you know the history you'll know Muhammad stole ideas from other religions particularly christianity, also stories Christians talked about. Islam is basically a copy of christianity, but with evil intent. You dont mention how islam got people to convert. If islam was peaceful, it would not have lasted as a religion, that's why Muhammad became political and a jihadist.

    34. Hammerstein

      Mohammed was a pedophile so anyone that follows him supports child rape

    35. sydmmr1985

      Outstanding analysis!!

    36. Nasheed Nazms

      quite impress even muslims impressed with a good lecture his honest account by fred Donner..the quaran is a basic manual it does tell you to pray but the actual prayer and how to pray practical comes from mohamed via god example there are 5 prayers. and how to stand in prayer what to pray in prostration ..the quran verses are read in prayer

      1. forhad karim

        Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him. Dont you know better how to properly introduce our prophet?

    37. Random Person

      Islam is a cult Allah is not God Mohammed is a fool The Quran is a fairytale

    38. Nusrat Rizvi

      Mrs. Letiti James NY State Office of Attorney General Mrs. James: Madam: I am appalled to learn you have seen fit to attend a conference of Muslims lawyers in NYC to be held this April 4th. Every single immigrant who came to these shores wanted to become an American but the Muslims feel they have a better religion and any association with other faiths would only devalue Islam. The contradictory message plays havoc with the Muslim kids born or raised here. As their American peers shunned them these kids now considered misfits had no choice but to befriends other Muslims facing similar ostracism. This was the group that in 2015 welcomed the call to fight for lslam by lClS in Syria and they did this by the thousands, those survived came back as experienced soldiers to fight another day. But this was not a difficult choice for US born kids since Koran specifically forbids adherents to befriend Christians or Jews. Few can match Muhammad's nauseating deeds and habits. Aside from looting caravans he killed hundreds who question his divinity. He loved young girls and married one Six-year-old. Told followers to marry only 4 but married 11 himself. He cockled his adopted son Zaid and publicly admitted that his latest revelations were put in his mouth not by Allah but the devil himself. He hated democracy and as a consequence all 64 Muslim countries in the UN are run by deranged dictators, who do not accept democracy nor permit free elections. As a result, all opponents challenging the rulers are either jailed or killed. Dear Mrs. James, can you please urge these lawyers that this land of the free will not only not accept their faith without serious amendments to bring them up to standards found in all civilized countries in the West. We will never tolerate a Sharia law that lets Husbands beat their wives to pulp or divorce them at will. A religion that permits a wealthy man to pay blood money and a poor thief to lose his hand for stealing a loaf of bread can never be defended or tolerated. Our founding fathers Jefferson, John Adam and son J.Q Adam along with Mark Twain and Winston Churchill have all openly denounced Islam as an abomination since Islam claims this life in only a test and the real rewards like rivers of Milk and Honey along with 72 virgins await you only in the hereafter. Nusrat Rizvi Palm City FL

    39. Nusrat Rizvi

      Use the word Republic and Allah becomes shit, Hence no election anywhere in Islamic countries, now not before, not now or ever. Nusrat Rizvi Palm City FL.

    40. Juan Vélez

      “On Human Suffering and the Concept of God” - the psychological basis of religious belief

    41. kristopher slaght

      Islam is not a religion

    42. jason sha

      the pedo profit gangster mohamhed and stick ya halal no one knows where islam came from only the desert knows halal is a moden tax god dose not care what you eat God does not have a restront islam is a shit religion it was for the Arabs because it help the arab to have their own religion religion devides us all its a tradional brain wash and a con for the fools of earth we have to name everything Go{o}d {d}evil

    43. TheIsmaelIsaac

      As Arabic speaker I must say that you are very knowledgeable and very fluent in Arabic.

    44. silvério rebelo

      this talk is very very poor in historical data and criticism...

    45. Miguel Sureda

      Tsunami of ex muslims on the net. Coming out of the closet massively.

      1. *Floofy shibe*

        David N What about Judaism? It’s strange to leave out the origin of the abrahamic bullshit

      2. David N

        Miguel Sureda Islam Is built of Christianity They are both false

    46. Jerome Slappy

      The uncanny spread of Islam to all western Christian countries makes me think that Islam is the vehicle religion of the antichrist...

      1. bo william

        The Christ is a Muslim. There I settle that for you.

    47. Stefan Nilsson

      This guy has clearly not read the Quran. He knows the history of islam, but he knows nothing about muslim beliefs and views.

      1. bo william

        @Stefan Nilsson Have a great day Sir. May Allah guide you.

      2. Stefan Nilsson

        @bo william Both you and I know this can't be explained away with "translation errors". I doubt you have actually read it through since the statistics speak against you. Most muslims who do read everything becomes apostates.

      3. bo william

        @Stefan Nilsson I will tell you too look further into these claims. In the Arabic language it was written in. Not a a translation. Peace to you Sir

      4. Stefan Nilsson

        @bo william ​ The Quran has many errors. * It says that the stars are way closer than they are in reality. * It says that the sky is a ceiling. * It says that the moon was split in two, and that it can split in two again in the future. * It says that the moon emits light when in reality it just reflects light from the sun that hits it. * It says that the sun sets in a muddy spring. * It says that humans were created from dust/clay. * It says that semen is created between the ribs and back bones. * In 3 separate places, it confuses Miriam (sister of Moses) with Mary (mother of Jesus. It thinks that they are the same person. They lived over 1000 years apart from each other. * It says that it is the direct word of Allah. That means, if the Quran is wrong. Allah has to be wrong. How can we trust that anything Allah says is true? How can we be sure he exists? And there are many, many more mistakes in the Quran that I haven't listed. There is a reason why like 90% of the muslims who take their time to read everything leaves Islam.

      5. bo william

        I have read it. Many times

    48. P Am

      Islam is cancer on earth

    49. James Greene

      You put me to sleep droning on and on about superstitious beliefs

    50. Abdullah Al-Selwi

      Yes, a new look to the beginning is needed

      1. Miriam Sackler

        Abdullah Al-Selwi I am a non-practising New York Jew married to a devout Episcopalian Irish man. We just visited the Umayyad Mosque in Damascus. What a magnificent building! What I’ve found remarkable is that the Shrine of Nabi Yahya bin Zakarya (St. John the Baptist), has been given a special place inside the Sanctuary of the mosque. John, my husband, not the Prophet, has been very proud ever since that he got the chance to visit the shrine dedicated to the eponymous of his namesake, in a Muslim country of all places, far away from his parents’ native Ireland.

    51. Mohammed Amine Taibi

      Very good analysis and impressive Arabic pronounciation. However, I think you put so much emphasis on the distinction between a believer and a muslim. In Arabic the two words may be used as synonyms sometimes, but according to a prophetic tradition, it has been explained that a Muslim's relation to God starts by becoming a Muslim, which essentially consists of obeying the commandments of the Five Pillars of Islam. Next comes "Iman", believing, which is the next step in a Muslim's approaching to God's favor. The concept consists of believing in the existence of God, his angels, his holy books, his prophets, the Latter Day and finally in the existence of fate. The last step is called "Ihsan" I don"t know how to translate this one to English, but I'll try to explain it here. Ihsan is the highest level of faith that a Muslim could strive for, it essentially means worshipping God as if one were sure that He sees their every move. The notion of Ihsan is a little troubeling because it challenges Muslims' belief in God's omnipresence. The perfect Muslim is supposed to remember God in each and every moment of thei lives, that's why if you ever get to meet a really devout Muslim you'd find them repeating mantras (oral prayers) specific to every action they make during the day. There are mantras for when you wake up, when you bath, before you eat, after you eat, while you eat in case you forgot to say it at the beginning, when you go out, when you come back home etc...

      1. Zahra Mahde

        🙏🌺 It's good to be musl8 God Bless you إحسان

    52. Abolhussein Amiri

      What is so evil about this satanic cult is not that it has turned believers of this cult violent and evil, this instrument of satan mohammad had a problem with dogs, and today these poor animals suffer torture and death amongst the believers of this evil cult.

    53. interpretation 21

      The beginning of the false faith began in the mental illness of that madmans mind. Allah is not the God of the old canon or new . Absurd. You must understand that the madman was mentally ill and both demon possessed. You must no longer see their Allah as god .....these people are under the rule of demons . The 2 men or animals that established the false faith were from India...they were lowly thugs...with depraved ideas...they wanted power and were willing to lie for it and secure that lie with murders. Brutality followed. Thats how they control people; terror. In Canada they brought in their brothers to form the gangs on the left and they have taken over the police to turn them into a paramilitary police force ...they are endemically controlling convenience stores (7 eleven, circle k, McDonald's and hiring *against* Europeans and native Americans ) It surprises to see how all this had happened.

      1. Rasheed Davis

        Ignorant weirdo

    54. Udayan Mitra

      I really don’t care how Islam started, when will it end?

      1. Abolhussein Amiri

        @Salman Hyder All religions have the right to exist, the only so called religion which is actually a satanic cult should be banned from the face of this planet. It is a criminal cult and all those who actually believer in it, should be re-educated, as China is doing in the Uighar province to its population.

      2. Udayan Mitra

        Salman Hyder : forget Hinduism, the end of Islam is upon us with sectarian violence within Islam reaching a crescendo...

      3. Salman Hyder

        It will end after we have ended the cult of tyrannical Hinduism out of the face of earth through intellectual resistance.

      4. Abolhussein Amiri

        As people become more educated of their Universe and see what a primitive cult this cult of satan aka islam is

      5. common common

        The day its people leave it. And when they avoid the Christianity mongers like plague. That's when Islam will properly end.

    55. arauna palm

      Read the Quran and the Sirah (islam's own biography of their prophet). It gives one the core ideas of islam and the actions of Mohammad. He was a merchant and travelled far and wide. At night he used to sit down around the fire and listen to jews and christians talk. Mohammed claimed later he was the last prophet of both faiths. You do not address why islam spilled out of its own territory and took over in political way other territories. You do not talk about the wars the prophet was involved in and how he paid his warriors..... ....

      1. arauna palm

        @radwan rhmani of course he attacked the caravans of mecca 97 times. What whitewashed history have you been reading? He was planning wars when he died. It was written down 200 years after his death in the Sirah. His followers followed his example when they invaded Persia, north Africa, Spain a d Tours in France.

      2. arauna palm

        @radwan rhmani The scholar above cherry picked the "convenient" bits for his talk....... as most scholars do these days...... such as those christian scholars who write theses on "liberation theology". You have it wrong- not all prophets went to war. The greatest prophet was Jesus - because he never went to war. He did not participate in pre-emptive or defensive wars........ but there were also other faithful prophets of the true God who also did not participate in defensive wars.

      3. Wf Coaker

        @radwan rhmani Of course you don't. Im not sure how much you understand about Christianity, but there are things about Islam that are, frankly, shocking to Christians.

      4. Wf Coaker

        @radwan rhmani Two reasons. First, the Old Testament Hebrews were commanded to claim the land promised to them at a time when brutal warfore was the norm. God meets us where we are. Second, Mohammed was acting AFTER Jesus came to bring the New Covenant. Violence was no longer valid. It is not part of the Gospel. Christians are not told to fight against the unbelievers, to kill them if they won't convert or pay extortion money, and are forbidden from taking revenge. Love and forgiveness are commanded to Christians, not violence. My main issue is the claim by Muslims that their prophet stands in the line of Jesus and the Biblical prophets. He clearly does not. The teachings of Islam are not in the tradition of Christianity at all. Whether it is true or not is another matter. I don't believe it is because it represents such a change from the Gospel that I have believed all my life. That's merely my belief. Whether it is right or wrong, it is clearly bears no resemblance to the teachings of Jesus. And that doesn't even begin to address the mystical meaning of the Incarnation, which presents a very different cosmology from Islam.

      5. radwan rhmani

        @Wf Coaker ok (so I am gonna use the word claim here to prove my point), so even if you compare him to Jesus, they both (claim) to follow what God commanded. you see where you choose to compare between Jesus and Muhammad i chose to compare the commands from God to both, since God commanded his followers to fight before i see no issue for him to do so once again and i do not see how you find an issue with that.

    56. Richard Wendling

      <a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="748">12:28</a> The volume spikes, I had a feeling there was a problem with his mic...Watch out iof wearing headphones or watching late with speakers...

      1. Ahmad haki

        Richard Wendling thank you

    57. Hossain Zamil

      Newly educated muslims be like lets send Two jinns after him

    58. Jeroen Stobbe

      Muhammedans are just the saddest people. Indoctrinated to not use God's biggest gift to man, our brains! :-)

      1. Abolhussein Amiri

        @Omer How can I be a devil spawn, you are the believer in the satanic cult of islam, you believe in the sexual pervert mohammad who is at this moment in HELL.

      2. Abolhussein Amiri

        @Omer you Omer are a worshipper of Satan aka Allah

      3. Omer

        Seek help for your mental illness you sick minded individual. A degenerate atheist irrational and illogical.

    59. Asadul Hasan Rasel

      The result of radiocarbon dating of the parchment on which the text is written places the manuscript in the period between 568 and 645 with 95.4% probability. The testing was commissioned from the University of Oxford and carried out in 2014. This result suggests that the manuscript dates back to the first century of Islam, close to the lifetime of the Prophet Muhammad (about 570-632) and the rule of the first three Caliphs. Source :

      1. Asadul Hasan Rasel

        @paul vorderwinkler NO, go to Birmingham university's website, they say this parchment was *NOT* washed or rewritten. But Sanaa manuscript which was found in Yemen, was washed and rewriiten. That was proved during analysing that manuscript. But Birmingham Qur'an manuscript was *NOT* washed or rewritten because they *DIDN'T* find any evidence of washing and rewriting in this manuscript. There are more information in University's website, Source :

      2. paul vorderwinkler

        the point is not when the parchment was *made*. it would be stupid to wait for decay of the animal corpse and to take the skin later, wouldn`t it? the point is, when was the present text written on the parchment. as you write yourself, it is all a matter of probabilities without any clear proof. there is no way to date the ink stains; there is the possibility that the parchment was washed, dried again and rewritten upon later, this is why the animal`s death time is nothing but the *earliest possible time at which a text could have been written*, and not evidence for the document`s age. radio carbon dating is one single technique, and several techniques and multiple research fields are required to date an old document - you need codicology, etymology, archaeology, philology and several more.

      3. Asadul Hasan Rasel

        @paul vorderwinkler In ancient times, parchment were made immediately after animal death *because in those days there was NO modern way of preservation for long time.* Those manuscript were most likely from 630 to 660 Common Era. *Source :* *Source :*

      4. paul vorderwinkler

        Asal Hasan Rasel > wrong. it says that there was a goat that died between 568 and 645 AD with a probability of 95,4%. everything else suggested on the basis of that method is speculation.

    60. Muhammad Asif

      Heaven folks want a name for the total package. Look, all other famous names are mostly associated with human race. Messiah hates racism; well, according to his own criteria. Let the name of total divine package be Islam/Peace. How is that? 😁 Thanks. 🙄 😆 Kali was an ex-atheist. Divine TEKKEN tournament ends. Mishimas win, as usual. 😉

      1. Jeroen Stobbe

        Your English is terrible.. No idea what you're saying..

    61. Stephens Dygert

      Islam is a bastardized version of Judaism. The god of islam. Is not the God of the Bible. Islam is a performance system based on the law of Moses, mixed with Arab mysticism, and the occult. Allah(god) is the crescent moon god. Any religion islam- mormonism- jehovah witnesses- seventh day adventism - catholicism all teach salvation by islam. The main thing to remember about islam, The Apostle Paul condems this false religion, as well as Mormonism in Galatians chapter one. Very clear. Both religions claim Angels gave new revelation of god. Joseph Smith claims the angel moroni gave him new revelation in gold plates. islam claims the angel Gabriel gave Mohammed new revelation. The key thing to remember about islam is critial !! This religion denies the death, burial and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ. It rejects the diety of the Lord Jesus Christ, being the great "I AM" Alpha Omega, the image of the invisible God. islam and catholicism are Satan's greatest masterpieces. Catholicism takes truth, and turns it, into a lie. Islam takes a lie, and tries to turn it, into truth. Both teach salvation by works. Jesus said, Before Abraham, I AM, unless you BELIEVE, I AM, Ye will die in your sins. Catholicism has nothing to do with God of the Bible. Its another "jesus" and another "spirit"

    62. Big Dirt

      So Islam WAS a religion of peace until it became a political crusade. Unlike the Roman empire it brought nothing in the way of technological progress. The followers of Islam basically enslaved and taxed the conquered communities of "infidels" so that they could get on with praying and fasting and fiddling with young girls and boys.

    63. whoelseeverdiedforyou ?

      WANT THE TRUTH ON HOW ISLAM BEGAN? here on NOsel, type ALBERTO SERIES, then watch the 6th video about islam. this info came from an ex-priest who became a born again believer in Jesus Christ and lived to meet a Christian publisher named Jack Chick.....both men's reputations were smeared during their lives and they risked their lives to share this information. May The Lord God Almighty open the eyes of those who search for this truth with a sincere and repentant heart.

      1. Wf Coaker

        Yeah, because Jack Chick was a good example of Christianity. Lolol

    64. Sheki Shral

      Well when you ignore thousands of ahadiths (Olar past down tradition of the prophet) than you can try to put christians and jews in "Islam" (very bias approach)

      1. Jeroen Stobbe

        Sheki Shral All hadith should be ignored.. The fairytales of the brothers Grimm have more truth in them!

    65. Obaid ALMansoori

      God is male Goddess is Female Allah is neither male or Female

      1. Jeroen Stobbe

        Obais ALMansoori very relevant.....

    66. Farfaniyal

      Hey hello..... Islam began with the creation of the first human being ADAM (peace be upon him) ..........

      1. RedEyeOfJupiter 2121

        Actually Brother.... Even before the "Creation" of This Universe there was Islam. EVERTHING EVER Created Submits to the Will, Direction & Plan of Allah (God). i.e. Islam

    67. Francelee Paris

      Hmmm... another western interpretation of Islam... the Roman Empire was fragmented and ready to crack because it ruled through fear... Islam came along and offered equality with no single ruler dictating the law.. those who became Muslims paid no taxes... those who chose not to were taxed... people simply chose the best beneficial route.. funny how all these ‘scholars’ look to Islam for evidence of its rapid spread... what happened to all the ‘great western scholars’.. why did they not write about what was happening at the time... oh that’s right .. they would have been burnt as heretics..

    68. Angel Rojas

      Layer Allah is not the same god of the Christians . You have to know the God of the Christians is not stupid

    69. Shabba

      Christianity is not monotheistic as long as it holds the belief that Jesus is the son of God or himself God and the belief in the trinity which isn't once mentioned in th Bible. Very superficial lecture.

      1. Wf Coaker

        You do realize that just because something isn't in the Bible doesn't mean it ismt true, right? Christians aren't slaves to a book. We are children of God, citizens of His Kingdom, and the Holy Spirit indwells the Church. Jesus Himself said the Spirit would lead us into all truth. That means the Spirit is still leading us into all truth.

    70. mike voltamp

      Where goes Islam, slavery and misery follow.

    71. Sans Decorum

      This is easy. Islam began when the seventh century version of a Charles Manson, desperate for attention and power, conned and then amassed an army of thugs by way of a promised 80 /20 split of all conquests to spread his psychosis and support his savage and degenerate appetites. Fast forward fourteen centuries and it is pretty much the same mindset with the same motivations; spread out, infest and infect.

    72. Pierre

      He is pushing forward a propaganda of his own wishful thinking

    73. الداعس على الله ورسوله

      Religion of terror

    74. Jeje Wa

      Islam was started by Abdul Malik the fifth Kaliph who used a dead mental and sick individual to develop based on ear say and myths a sect based on doctrine to enhance his powers!

      1. RedEyeOfJupiter 2121

        You are amazing with Your level of Idiocy. Actually "Islam" (Submission to God) Begins When God Created the Universe because EVERYTHING Submits to the Will & Direction of God.

    75. b-m

      when he decides that the allah the moon god is the same as the God of the hebrews and christians, he loses all credibility with anyone who has done a little reading. The difference between allah and Yahweh are significant. mo tried to legitimate his religion by borrowing characters from the Hebrew bible and putting his words in their mouths. the JEws and Christians of his day were not fooled. So neither should you be fooled.

      1. GSpotter63

        @b-m Yes I would say that is exactly what appears to have happened.

      2. b-m

        @GSpotter63 what i'm referring to is a video by the apostate prophet where he shows that mohamed thought that the generic word for god was the actual name of god used by the christians and/or hebrews. it's evidence that he was just making stuff up based on limited knowledge

      3. GSpotter63

        @b-m That is what I just said.... The god described by Islam is not the same god described by Judaism or Christianity. Islam claims that their god is the same but it is not.

      4. b-m

        @GSpotter63 the funny thing is that Allah is a generic word like our word 'god' it is not a name of god at all.

      5. GSpotter63

        I was going to say the exact same thing... The word Allah may mean God in Arabic but the description given of who Allah was did not match those found in the Jewish and Christian traditions or their doctrines. How or why he left out this very important point is a bit perplexing.

    76. ProGamer01

      I am Muslim and I agree with him. Both Muslims and Christians are no longer practising their original religions. Muslims put too much focus on the laws and less on the more important basics of the religion (Gods mercy and spreading love among his creatures), whereas Christians put too much focus on church authority and dogmas but less on Gods unity. Mohamed took care of the poor and the sick. So did Jesus. Both lived in humbleness. If they came back today, they would probably live among refugees in the poorest communities of the world. They would not recognize all these trendy and flashy mosques and churches.

      1. ProGamer01

        Wf Coaker You are ”not in the least islamophobic”?? Well, that is a big statement but unfortunately with no substance in it. You insult prophet Mohamed - the most holy person for Muslims - and it is not islamophobic?? You words are full of contradictions so there is no point having a reasonable discussion with a person like you. You want discuss about attrocities commited by Christianity, but I am not going to say bad stuff on Chistianity since I have full respect for that religion. And by the way Christ is also a holy prophet for Islam. I have also respect for others religions as well including non-Abrahamic religions, because you respect people by respecting their religions. But you think you have the ”truth” in your pockets and can be arrogant by condemning other peoples religions and call them bigots. Well, that itself is bigotery. I don’t know how old you are, but I think you have a lot to learn in your life. Bye.

      2. Imperial D

        @ProGamer01 just me

      3. Wf Coaker

        @ProGamer01 I am not in the least Islamophobic. I just have no time for ideological historical revisionism. Mohammed brought peace? Tell that to the people he massacred. Tell that to the people who died in battle after battle as Islam spread during his lifetime. I'm a Christian, but if you want to talk about the evils done in the name of Christ from the Edict of Milan up till today, I'd be glad to do it. I have no more patience with revisionism of Christian history than I do with anything else. Honesty is not hatred, revisionism is not inclusion. We can't fix the problems of the world unless we are honest. Religious bigots ignore reality just as much as you are doing. You are opposite sides of the same coin, ignoring reality in favour of your self serving ideology. All that does is enable evil people to continue their actions. We Christians have to be honest about our history. Muslims have to be honest about theirs. We'll never fix things otherwise, and hatemongers will win. But that will require you giving up your "progressive" ideology, just like the other side of your coin will have to give up their bigotry. I doubt either of you will have the balls to do it. You're too caught up in your identity politics.

      4. ProGamer01

        Imperial D Do you have double identity here? My previous reply was ”Wf Coaker”. But a reply surprisingly came from you!

      5. Imperial D

        @ProGamer01 r u drunk? I have no problem with Islam. I'm saying it is no more violent than any other group or power from that period. Just because I don't believe in religion, doesn't mean I think any less or more of people who do. if u wanna believe in mohamed, or moses, or jesus, or bhudda, or whoever. go ahead. if it makes u happy. It doesn't effect me. i respect all religions, i just dont believe in them.

    77. A Lost One

      So Judaism, Christianity, and Islam were all developed during a time when most of the world was illiterate and are evidences for what truly happened is weak. And yet we hold onto these beliefs so fervently? Epistemology...look it up. Question your beliefs.

      1. Cliff Wilson

        With regards to Christianity we know that Matthew was literate, otherwise he could not be a tax collector. And clearly Paul was literate, as were the people they wrote to, then clearly copyists were literate, and folks always liked to be read to so I just don't know where you're trying to go with this.

    78. H R Soliman

      This guy is more likely a painter & decorator or a plumber not a historian. He's either the ultimate ignorant or the ultimate liar orientalist ever lectured about Islam! I couldn't find a single sentence of what he uttered that can be described as accurate, true or acceptable. ❌👀❌

    79. Mike Cruise

      1.9 billion people believe in prophet Muhammad message because direct he got it from God Quran job of one man prophet Muhammad nobody’s going to come to the earth to come with a book like that this book (Quran)direct from creator God

    80. Steve Meikle

      given the Arab veneration of ancestors is there any shred of evidence that they were descended, or thought they were so descended, from Ishmael son of Abraham; this separate and distinct from Muslim thought and predating them?